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I mean we can agree to disagree on the simple notion of, "Whats the difference between no conclusions, and bad conclusions?"
There is none, they are both objectively negative town EV. Unless your whole plan is to pretend to look townie, else I see no arguable reason why people are where they are

you are correct in that its, "defined by you", but that is the only correct statement you've made thus far, since your evaluations of the game state, are utter nonsense.

I see no difference between writing incorrect/premature evaluations, that don't have any real thought behind them, and writing no conclusions at all.

This is a reminder to my future self that I have a sorta-kinda take here but it's a little too early to state it explicitly.

Though I will say I kind of doubt scumWisp rolls into the thread with "I'm not gonna push the game." *Maybe* he thinks he can get away with it on a new forum. Maybe this is a bad Too Wolfy To Be A Wolf read. I'll clarify in a page or two.

Another self-reminder: mushy cereal. I promise on my town role PM that this is not a secret code for anything except to remind myself of a read I don't want to share yet, because I'm too lazy to take real notes.

-

I...*want* to like bessie. And yet.

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:12 amWhy Suzaku? At the time you made this post there were other players that had done similar or less in their opening posts.

Like who? And did you really FoS two people without voting?

I also don't think bessie has provided enough content/reads to be in a position to others to provide *their* reads.

ugh

to be in a position to *pester* others

Bessie's FoS is so hilariously disjointed from any logic
Sabrar: "writes filler"
Bessie: FoS

filler on a non-contextual level is just a blanket statement, it's not inherently wolfy for someone to drop in some fun thoughts/discussion
its less of a problem now, but maybe way later into the game it might mean something
Her response in regards to Suzaku is better, because I can see the disconnect between the tone and the stuff posted.

though Vaimes points out a slight chainsaw defense, where they dont attempt to defend suzaku, but argue other people did the same thing
think its too soon to argue to move either way with Bessie, I can find thoughts I like and hate
I am not at all surprised with Morgan's writing style, since it tends to be a lot of, "I am writing 4d chess statements"
Maybe there is a possibility that him mentioning town role pm, means something, but im going to go with it being NAI

Vaimes calling out bessie is good, kinda wish he voted there
but honestly, he somehow calls out Bessie, while avoiding not even voting for them
while also calling out Bessie for calling out people without actually voting them
its beautiful

"Though I will say I kind of doubt scumWisp rolls into the thread with "I'm not gonna push the game." *Maybe*"
crazy since a lot of my wolf games on MTGS consisted of this playstyle, so IDK why it gets TWTBAW here

Eh, I probably am going to vote for bessie. The more I reread that post, the less I liked it.

Kind of wish she and I would be able to real-time first, but with her schedule it seems unlikely.

I'd at least like to see where her head is at after she catches up again.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:06 am "Though I will say I kind of doubt scumWisp rolls into the thread with "I'm not gonna push the game." *Maybe*"
crazy since a lot of my wolf games on MTGS consisted of this playstyle, so IDK why it gets TWTBAW here

I have gone to great efforts to forget everything about mafia ever during my hiatus.

Eh whatever, I think daddy Wisp is town now and he wants a vote, so I vote.

Unvote, vote bessie

I have a hard time seeing the flow of bessie's post come from a villager. The soft-defense of Suzaku followed by a somewhat over-the-top FoS for a completely separate reason is baffling. bessie clearly made pre-post edits, but not about this readflip? Not to mention that she: has no real reads but is poking other people for theirs, is vaguely throwing shade at other people without naming them, and completely overlooked the opportunity to get a read on MathBlade when she critiqued him for his Suzaku read, but didn't.

(I'm unsure of multiposting etiquette so this will be my last one for now.)

@bessie

Sorry, but if you're only gonna post evenings PST then we will literally never be online at the same time. I would have preferred to feel you out in realtime before pushing you, but so it goes.

ya I'm not currently ready to vote, I want to make sure I hit a wolf with my first post
since it makes me feel smart

vote: Bessie
Party time

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:33 am ya I'm not currently ready to vote, I want to make sure I hit a wolf with my first post
since it makes me feel smart

the truly smart thing to do would be push bessie but then vote a counterwagon :]

Hmmm I don’t like the Bessie wagon given it seems to rely on Suzaku scum and Suzaku isn’t flipped so we don’t know if the premise is true.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:18 am maybe lvl 0 is mean, but I think both of you think those posts say more than they actually do, when they don't
in terms of Moody, I don't even understand the relevance of the numbers

So…if you don’t understand something…it is therefore worthless to everyone?

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:18 am This game revolves around vote manipulation, it's evident in both the OP of the day phase, and in regards to Suzaku's posts about their vote not registering, I also have my own information, and questions to the mod that explain how he would handle people being unable to be voted, or vote specific player, and that is, he won't count their vote in the VC.

if Osie's other games are any evidence, a 3p exists somewhere, I am saying this for sake of clarifying my thoughts on the setup
I don't think this should be talked about anymore today

Interesting that you seem so concerned about talking about voting powers, yet you have discussed it the most and revealed a great deal of information to the thread.

Also, for someone that is sooooo concerned, you did not even bother to check the post where Suzaku’s vote for Wam had not been counted, or you would have seen that Osie edited the vote count.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:18 am @Zeniba
where are you?

You are also only paying attention to the game content selectively, or you would be reading every post not just those you wish to pick apart.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:22 am those aren't read lists, they don't say anything, though I guess Suzaku's says more than Moody, if that means anything

It was an attempt to do some analysis of the game content thus far. We don’t all have the magic gift to be able to solve the game on page 1.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:22 am what do you think of Moody, and Suzaku?

Why don’t you read my previous post? I am suspicious of Suzaku noting that his vote wasn’t counted, but not necessarily curious as to why. And I like moody so far and agree with his response to Sabrar here .

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:22 am Vibing means, I am very unlikely to be a voice any time soon, and kawaii means cute, I was trying to be funny, but the arguement was mostly, "moody and Suzaku being wolves would be pretty depressing in terms of standards im used to"

And Wisp, I’m sorry* if we don’t meet your extremely high standards of how you think mafia is supposed to be played. Believe me, I’m really happy to see you here and hope you to see you join our community. But the original xkcd forum was not a mafia site. Almost all of us are just people that joined xkcd because we were fans of the xkcd comic, and we found our way to the mafia subforum hidden in another subforum. If I want to be a professional mafia player, there are sites for just playing mafia. I play with these people because we have fun, don’t take it too seriously, and enjoy each other’s company. I hope you can do the same without further remarks like this.

*I’m not really.

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:28 am I see no difference between writing incorrect/premature evaluations, that don't have any real thought behind them, and writing no conclusions at all.

Ok. So we should all just remain silent until we can create a masterpiece. Got it.

Morgan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:33 am Like who? And did you really FoS two people without voting?

I don’t usually vote until closer to deadline. And I never RVS. When I vote, it will be serious and on a scum read, not for pressure or reactions.

And… what do you think of SuperJedi’s opening post?

Morgan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:53 am I also don't think bessie has provided enough content/reads to be in a position to others to provide *their* reads.

Would you rather I just be… vibing?

Wisp wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:06 am filler on a non-contextual level is just a blanket statement, it's not inherently wolfy for someone to drop in some fun thoughts/discussion
its less of a problem now, but maybe way later into the game it might mean something

Again, you’re not even trying to understand people in their own context, just through the filter of what you expect to see.

Morgan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:21 am I have a hard time seeing the flow of bessie's post come from a villager. The soft-defense of Suzaku followed by a somewhat over-the-top FoS for a completely separate reason is baffling. bessie clearly made pre-post edits, but not about this readflip? Not to mention that she: has no real reads but is poking other people for theirs, is vaguely throwing shade at other people without naming them, and completely overlooked the opportunity to get a read on MathBlade when she critiqued him for his Suzaku read, but didn't.

My style is pretty consistent as any alignment. Every evening I read through the thread starting where I left off, and I respond to things that I feel are relevant or interesting, and I try to answer all questions. Then I review and reflect on the content as a whole, and make any annotations before I post it. If two different posts gave me two different impressions of a player, why should I disregard one? I note both, and wait for further content to refine my impressions.

And interesting that you think I was defending Suzaku with this:

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:12 am

MathBlade wrote: ↑Thu Nov 18, 2021 7:13 am [v]Suzaku[/v]

For not interacting or getting a single read other than RVS. Give me some opinion on what you read.

Why Suzaku? At the time you made this post there were other players that had done similar or less in their opening posts.

If you read it carefully (or objectively) you would know it wasn’t about Suzaku at all, it was about MathBlade.

Morgan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:30 am Sorry, but if you're only gonna post evenings PST then we will literally never be online at the same time. I would have preferred to feel you out in realtime before pushing you, but so it goes.

I will be around this weekend, but weekdays are tough for me.

whether their vote was counted or not by a mistake
it doesn't change what my ability is, nor what the OP of the day states
nor how Osie likes building his games around a specific mechanic as of lately

last game had a lot of KP, and lots of ways of preventing it
but maybe I am overthinking this, who knows

im going to sleep, unlike Vaimes I am well aware of your posting habits, but I wasn't familiar with the voting closer to EoD aspect of your playstyle, so thanks for clarifying that

I'll get to the rest of your post at some point after I wake up, or after work

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:12 am And this is ironic considering historically most of the time your reads of Madge are “Madge is Madge so therefore town”.

No, most of the time my read was that Madge is town!Madge and I have explained in Crossover my reasons for that.

I agree with moody regarding the culture clash, we've had a lot of those the first time where people from two different forums played together.

I get good vibes from some of Wisp's replies.

I love snarky!bessie, I think I'm gonna sheep her.

Unvote

Votecount

Votee (Votes/Elimination) - Voter(s)
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

bessie (2/8) - Morgan, the worst
Suzaku (2/8) - MathBlade, Wam
Wisp (1/8) - moody7277
moody7277 (1/8) - Suzaku

Not Voting (7): bessie, madge, patzer, Sabrar, SuperJedi224, Wisp, Zeniba

Elimination Deadline is 10 AM PST on November 22nd.

Zeniba is still on Vacation/Limited Access (V/LA) for a couple of IRL days.

Wisp wrote: ↑Thu Nov 18, 2021 7:27 pm @suzaku
How common is it for you to make a read list like that, relatively early into the game?

From gut I wouldnt say it's out of the ordinary

unvote

vote bessie

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:55 am I don’t usually vote until closer to deadline. And I never RVS. When I vote, it will be serious and on a scum read, not for pressure or reactions.

And… what do you think of SuperJedi’s opening post?

I'll give thoughts on Jedi a little later. Is this answering the "who else posted content equal to or less than Suzaku" question? If so, why didn't you name them when you made the post?

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:55 amWould you rather I just be… vibing?

No, I'd rather you be giving reads. It isn't a binary. If you don't vote until deadline, okay, but what am I supposed to think of someone asking for reads who hasn't given any?

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:55 amIf you read it carefully (or objectively) you would know it wasn’t about Suzaku at all, it was about MathBlade.

Eh. I want to say that's a little too revisionist for me, but I do understand what you mean because I was attacked for this same thing once as town. There is a bit of Suzaku defense inherently built into questions like that, but I can accept that that wasn't your point.

But if it *was* about MathBlade, why didn't you give or even hint at a MathBlade read in that post? Or in this post? There's like no attempt there to sort him beyond asking that Suzaku question.

bessie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:55 amI will be around this weekend, but weekdays are tough for me.

They're tough for me too, because I work my day and night jobs now. We'll see.

I highly disapprove of the bessie wagon based on what I see to be it's premise.

Hm. Nothing strongly jumped out at me but might as well go through player list and see what I think.

Players from OP:

1. Suzaku
2. moody7277
3. madge
4. Zeniba
5. Wam
6. bessie
7. patzer
8. SuperJedi224
9. the worst
10. Morgan
11. Wisp
12. Sabrar
13. MathBlade

Suzaku: three posts. First is a random vote, second post is very weak stuff on all (understandably), only notable thing is accusing Wisp of “active lurking” but thinks that seems to be more of a culture difference. Nothing much to go on with him, neutral.

Moody: First post of content is targeting Wisp. Fairly similar reasons to Suzaku’s targeting. Will get back to thoughts on this once I’ve done my read on Wisp. Also disapproves of Bessie wagon- will have opinion more once I’ve read though Bessie’s posts.

On a coach that’s about to arrive rn; more reads later.

Ok there was a lot posted since the last time I got a chance to read this

It is looking like one of suzaku/bessie/wisp right now but we still really don't know much for certain

SuperJedi224 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:59 pm Ok there was a lot posted since the last time I got a chance to read this

It is looking like one of suzaku/bessie/wisp right now but we still really don't know much for certain

Why limit yourself to those others are already pushing?

lol

Based on that post, bessie, I’m not Jedi’s biggest fan.