Tales of Desolation mafia Day 2

[JC_DADDY25]

Note 2: since the psychic has a bunch of different variations without a real standard I should treat it like a custom role and explain what variation I'm treating as standard for this game. What I'm treating as standard psychic just gives a list of abilities that a person was targeted by.[/color]

Adum didn't actually say it was a self watcher, just what we're taking from Boom's claim, which we have confirmation of from the flavor cop as being true... unless that's also a lie.

[Santygrass]

Note 2: since the psychic has a bunch of different variations without a real standard I should treat it like a custom role and explain what variation I'm treating as standard for this game. What I'm treating as standard psychic just gives a list of abilities that a person was targeted by.[/color]

Adum didn't actually say it was a self watcher, just what we're taking from Boom's claim, which we have confirmation of from the flavor cop as being true... unless that's also a lie.

The post you are quoting is explicitly saying that the standard psychic (what bessie was) is a self watcher lol .

What do you think that note from Adum says regarding the psychic??

[Santygrass]

Oh I GOT IT. The difference is that psychic you can choose the person you want, it is not forced to be on yourself, like Frog psychic claimed to be

[Santygrass]

So basically my mistake was treating Frog Psychic description as the standard that bessie also had, when in reality it didnt have the only self target modifier?

But still this doesnt change my point of it not being an actual post death related role so /shrug

[Seven]

Vote count 2.6
1. Makhaira(1) - EGW
2. EGW(1) - Sabrar
3. Wam(1) - Santygrass
4. Sabrar(1) - Boomfrog
5. ahippo(0) -
6. TehBubblez Somitomi(0) -
7. Boomfrog(1) - heuristically_alone
8. Bop(0) -
9. JC_DADDY25(0) -
10. heuristically_alone(0) -
11. Madge(0) -
12. Laserguy Santygrass(0) -

Not voting: Makhaira, phillip, Somitomi, Bop, JC_Daddy25, Madge, Wam

With 12 players alive it takes 7 to eliminate

Day 2 ends Thursday January 30th at 2 am.

[Makhaira]

My bottom 3 rn based on just who doesnt seem to be really moving the ball much would be madge wam and JC but thats a very broad strokes take

What are your full reads at this moment, not just bottom four.

still getting fully caught up but jumping around the thread a lot, I need to look at EOD 1 again to look for blatant pileons

couple points I can make tho to help you see my POE


EGW - I really dont think you come at me the way you have this game if you were scum, I think youd be more content to let me cook myself and then pile on me when someone else starts to sour on me. maybe its hubris talking but idk your theories on me are kind of fucking wild lmao and I dont see scum!egw doing that, this is kinda similar to I think how adum sorted me in the last game with my halfcockedness if that makes sense

Wam - im bad at reading wam but wam hasn't really done anything that is out of scumrange to me so hes like null scumlean

Sabrar - also nothing completely convincingly out of scum range but early claim makes him easier to sort and he can cause overcentralized night play by scum (I will not elaborate on this point because I don't want scum to know why I want sab to complete his moves N2) so I dont think we ever flip him today outside of full wolf claim because of how much is loaded up on his slot as he has interacted with me which can net me info if I can reverse engineer what he did eventually, and with an alleged upcoming double ability use night he will be required to lay papertrail commitments that he cant back out of later which constrains his scum play in a non-zero capacity

ahippo - I just genuinely don't believe this slot early claims a role like supporter/motivator, doesnt feel in range, no offense to hippo, and if scum actually have a motivator power without a disloyal or weak restriction then idk what to say but my faith in adum's balance instincts will be shaken. plus I think this slot naturally is tethered to sab now which will cause it to retain heavy long term scrutiny and should eventually get naturally sorted based on NK tempo pressures, we can learn a lot about the setup thru this slot in most worlds and assuming Im not getting turbo snowed by a crazy early game coached all in

TehBubblez Somitomi - didnt like bubblez play at all but the AtE at the end felt legitimately like frustrated town. somi hasnt moved the needle much on the slot for me but I lean town here

Boomfrog - decent WIM and nothing has ping for me from their posts that seems blatantly wack but I know thats not a good enough standard to sort boom, he has range. I just dont think we pull the trigger on him today barring a very convincing case for something Im missing

Bop - this slot seems engaged without pressure to be engaged which I like, not afraid to lay papertrail and is contributing some unique perspective. no idea about their range though so trying to maintain healthy skepticism

JC - hasnt given me anything that moves the needle much out of null

heuristically_alone - I unironically cant tell if heury's energy levels this game are legit like a "new townie chapter" moment or if its just elaborate snow its frustrating im kinda stuck on this slot but am hesitant to go here early because heury trends miselim bait for me in early game

Madge - Im paranoid of madge and shes playing too passive for my liking which is a little hypocritical because im not a paragon of ball moving this game but like idk I dont think she's really committed to anything too substantial which just always comes off dodgey to me

Laserguy Santygrass - I honestly done see scum!santy caping for me so hard I think he knows rn Im exposing my neck and I think he would go for the kill her if given the chance so if its a crazy pocket Im just getting owned but idk I lean town here

[Makhaira]

Adum explained what he considers a psychic in this game, but you're asking if psychic is a self watcher? I've had a little trouble with this as well, as it didn't make sense for someone to be able to self target.

But we know that isn't true.

Psychic as adum has described it this game is a passive self ROLE watcher, you get returns of the roles that targeted you, not the players. Normal watcher gets playernames

[Makhaira]

Questioning that I liked/vibed from Mak D1

Hippo, how did bop know that you interpreted the RVS vote on you as a handshake/high five before you posted to say thats how you interpreted it

The order of those posts feels TMI hmmmmm

Thats like..... a pretty specific vibe to just "get"

Like almost a verbatim match

Read that I like v much , specifically considering it comes from a slot he was kinda pressing with the questions from above . I think I was towning hippo afeter the claim p hard, and reading this (thinking Mak was the stumped flipped town) made me lock hippo as town

I will point you to the fact that I explicitly did NOT ask for role. I simply asked "Do you have a power?"

Why Moody? Honest answer, when he voted for me, I just found it very endearing and wanted to ask someone I thought would answer. Vibes are all I've got right now.

Why do I care if Moody has a power? I can double a person's use of that power, once per night, only twice in the game, and on separate nights. Realizing now that if I do pick Moody, then that's an extra target on him, so ... yeah, it's useless if my target dies.

I'd probably just be better off using a random number generator to pick my target. I trust blind statistics more than my own intuition at this point.

alright I think this is locktown, only way it isnt is if adum included a disloyal supporter/motivator in the setup and frankly I dont think adum has much experience at all with loya/disloyal modifiers so I highly doubt this is a fake claim. I also doubt it is a claim from a scumslot that actually had a motivating power because Im assuming scum have day chat and theres no way the scumteam would allow a mate with that power, especially if it can double scum abilities, to claim it and thus allow the town to start directing it or scrutinizing the slot's picks. Like if hes a scum motivator that can double his mates abilities thats a busted ass role, hence why I think the only way it makes it to a scum side role in one of adums games is with a disloyal modifier or MAYBE a weak modifer, but I dont think adum is familiar with the former and wouldnt go for the latter especially if the game has redirects outside of the scum faction that would hypothetically have control of this motivator power

So ahippp, I had your role in the last game we played here. Given you have a limited number of shots, my normal advice would be to keep a low profile and focus on surviving as long as possible to wait for a big info generating PR claim that you think is legitimate and then buff that player and see what happens. Your power is very weak early game but becomes very powerful in the late game. Unfortunately, because of your premature claim, unless scum sniff out someone else that they think is trying to conceal that they are a strong PR, you are very likely to get night killed now. If there are protectives out there it could cause scum to have to try to outguess them on the yomi 1 play of NKing the only claimed PR

Depending on if adum is using NAR or not, you should be able to atleast get one use of your ability off tonight because generally NKs resolve last in the order. You should use your power on whoever you townread the strongest, but you should not announce or telegraph who that is

Randomimg your choice is generally fine this early in the game because this game is likely to be 12v3, 11v4 (if town is loaded up with strong PRs) or 11v2v2 (multiball is always possible in bigger games) so statistically you are more likely to hit a town role to double than a scum role with a random shot, so if you dont feel confident in your reads this isnt the worst option and it roughly trends town +EV

Mak Near EoD1 being active and trying to make people commit to votes and form wagons

Why did you go from 'not tunneling, just pressure' to 'seriously this is scum'?

Also just for my own understanding: what is the expected outcome of a 'pressure' vote? Are you hoping that the slot will suddenly improve their content, do you expect a claim, are you looking to see who joins the wagon?

the fact that bubblez disappeared for so long after the exchange just made me feel more confident of it being a scumslot but I was def overselling my confidence to try to sell the wagon

Im hoping to pressure the slot to produce more content that I can use to better sort, AND im trying to see who is willing to vote there and who isn't

This is something I do as town, since I think it helps more for me to solve the slot Im pressuring / gauge other reactions. Mak also doing it and taking the disappearence of their pressured slot as more damning makes sense to me

Not really. Alright, what's your bottom four as of currently, Mak?

Bubblez, fred, laser, bessie

Heury kinda at null line, tbh bessie is too

Counterpoint to all my above post is this. I could see this being ALL town. And like, at some point you have to hold people accountable for their reads

But yes everyone who is not voting should be voting at this point or youre kind of griefing

Quote pinging all the people not voting, time to make it happen we are under 6 hours to deadline I think

More of Mak actively trying to get votes/wagons forming

EGW give me cliffnotes on boom ill sheep you and sab there if theres something there

egw is boom really a more prudent long term play than bubblez or fred here

fred made it to late game last game and has basically given us nothing this game so tbh I think this is the safest play and could hit coasting scum

securing 8 on boom sounds like a big reach imo I really dont think we can lock in anyone other than bubblez or fred here

I will say that this soft defense of Frog and , active redirect/signaling to Fred reads a bit scum motivated, specially if Frog flips scum to keep in mind. There's also a bit of defense of hippo because of the claim, but given their pressure about the handshake stuff and reaction I dont think they are teamed (and hippo is stronly town to me)

EGW tell me scum!santy doesn't literally just flip the rhetoric of this post on its head and create an elaborate case shaming me for LAMIST and other shit, I think he could get bites, so it trends town to me because idk why scum!santy would really feel the need to pocket me so hard, I was super town read early but my equity has been fading like why buy my stock now as scum?

[JC_DADDY25]

Maybe I'm just stupid, because I don't see the words Passive or Self in that post.

[heuristically_alone]

Bessie flipping psychic is after death mechanical

How so? Psychic isnt a self watcher?

Can you explain this take a little more, considering the info we have been given.

I made an assumption on what physic is and didn't see Adum's post

[JC_DADDY25]

I am Laliah, Town Flavor Cop. Aligned with Shepherd, not aligned with a calamity. I detect whether or not a target is aligned with Lord of Calimity. I targeted Boom last night, and it is confirmed that he is Lord of Calimity. I do believe Boomfrog about there being two flavor cops, since the title of the game changed. I still thought he was scum, because I was told by the mod that this is not an alignment based cop, as town and scum may be aligned with a lord of calamity.

How useful do you feel you're going to be the rest of the game?

How can we trust you for the rest of the game now that everyone has flavor claimed, at this point you can now coast through and just say "so and so is not aligned with a Lord of Calamity"

And if you are scum, and you get to a point where you can lie to get someone Miselimmed because you can say they lied about their claim... well we are screwed.

[heuristically_alone]

If we miselim anyone due to EGW's claim that we elim EGW next day. Ez.

[JC_DADDY25]

If we miselim anyone due to EGW's claim that we elim EGW next day. Ez.

And if we're in lylo?

[JC_DADDY25]

Oh, and for the record... that flavor doesn't even show up in a flip and it's NAI so saying the person lied about their flavor doesn't necessarily make them scum so it means nothing.

[Makhaira]

If we miselim anyone due to EGW's claim that we elim EGW next day. Ez.

fwiw Im pretty sure none of the flipped townslots have any indication they are lord of calamity aligned which makes it a bit of a suss result but also too obvious especially with people saying that flavor is modconfirmed not AI

[Makhaira]

Maybe I'm just stupid, because I don't see the words Passive or Self in that post.

what post are you referring to? can you please quote it?

[Sabrar]

Im willing to claim if yall want me to given I havent given yall much to work with this phase, though Id like to hear sabs rationale for the demand first

Very vague explanation so as not to completely give away my role: something in what you said regarding me targeting you implies something that seems to contradict the info I have about my ability. I have thought about it extensively and simply cannot justify the discrepancy. I need you to claim first, without knowing what the discrepancy is.

[Makhaira]

but yeah i dont see adum making lord of calamity aligned an auto scum trait in a game with multiple flavor cop abilities floating around

I could see innominat having to devour a certain number of slots aligned with each or something tho to trigger some 3p wincon

[Sabrar]

fwiw Im pretty sure none of the flipped townslots have any indication they are lord of calamity aligned

moody claimed to be LoC-aligned

[Sabrar]

I could see innominat having to devour a certain number of slots aligned with each or something tho to trigger some 3p wincon

If Jester is considered to be bastard by Adum then I would think that would be as well.

[Makhaira]

Im willing to claim if yall want me to given I havent given yall much to work with this phase, though Id like to hear sabs rationale for the demand first

Very vague explanation so as not to completely give away my role: something in what you said regarding me targeting you implies something that seems to contradict the info I have about my ability. I have thought about it extensively and simply cannot justify the discrepancy. I need you to claim first, without knowing what the discrepancy is.

would me telling you the reason I dont think you RBd me is due to publicly available info help resolve the discrepancy?

[JC_DADDY25]

Note 2: since the psychic has a bunch of different variations without a real standard I should treat it like a custom role and explain what variation I'm treating as standard for this game. What I'm treating as standard psychic just gives a list of abilities that a person was targeted by.[/color]

Adum didn't actually say it was a self watcher, just what we're taking from Boom's claim, which we have confirmation of from the flavor cop as being true... unless that's also a lie.

The one I quoted here.

[Makhaira]

I could see innominat having to devour a certain number of slots aligned with each or something tho to trigger some 3p wincon

If Jester is considered to be bastard by Adum then I would think that would be as well.

wait what? how is that analogous to jester?

[Sabrar]

would me telling you the reason I dont think you RBd me is due to publicly available info help resolve the discrepancy?

I think so, it would help a bit more if you could somehow indicate what info you're talking about.

[JC_DADDY25]

Im willing to claim if yall want me to given I havent given yall much to work with this phase, though Id like to hear sabs rationale for the demand first

Very vague explanation so as not to completely give away my role: something in what you said regarding me targeting you implies something that seems to contradict the info I have about my ability. I have thought about it extensively and simply cannot justify the discrepancy. I need you to claim first, without knowing what the discrepancy is.

would me telling you the reason I dont think you RBd me is due to publicly available info help resolve the discrepancy?

So you respond to his post of not wanting to give away his role by giving away his role?