Tales of Desolation mafia Day 2

[heuristically_alone]

heuristically_alone – Completely NAI, as Heury is handsome and charming as any alignment.

Albeit with an nonstandard confirmation post, typical first 2 posts from Bessie. Nai

Hey Moody, do you have a night action? No need to specify faction or power. Simply, yes or no.

The hippocrisy!

Going back to boomfrog's vote, It feels really weird for boomfrog to be so vocal so early about a serious read. >:/

[madge]

Yes, bessie, you'd suffocate.

Work was mad today, I really should have stayed as a replacement. Right now I have two employees and on Monday I'll have three. I've got to set a good example by not being on the forum!!!

I'll do a proper post tomorrow, unless I don't. D1 is so performative and I'm pretty convinced that any ability to read this is well beyond me.

@Bessie have I ever made a good read, myself? an actual read, not like, mechanics analysis. I don't recall it ever happening, but you somehow have a photographic memory of 10+ years of mafia stuff (I'm another who started on xkcdia in 2012, hi)

[Sabrar]

Things that stood out upon reread:

As for D1 stuff, I'm never good with it
I know pretty much nobody here soooooo I'll vote closer to deadline lol

Gives off the vibe as though TehBubblez thinks all those RVS votes are final but at the same time they acknowledge that they are aware of the nature of D1.
Could be that they hate D1 on a level similar to Madge, still feels a bit like overexplaining in that case.

I'll accept that as a light early meta read for now but you've tied your fates together in my reads until further notice so for your sake I hope you're right.

Very strong conclusion to draw from an 'accepted light early meta read'. Could have been in jest but doesn't feel that way, more like a justification for a later read.

Bubbles defensiveness gives me a kinda newbie Town vibe.

Weird statement given they already claimed to be an experienced player.

Hippo, how did bop know that you interpreted the RVS vote on you as a handshake/high five before you posted to say thats how you interpreted it

The order of those posts feels TMI hmmmmm

Thats like..... a pretty specific vibe to just "get"

Like almost a verbatim match

I can imagine the scenario where scumbuddies talk about how to perceive a particular vote on one of them. I cannot imagine the scenario where after one of them assured the other that it was just a friendly handshake and nothing to worry about, scum would feel the need to jump in and 'defend' their buddy, deliberately using the same phrase.
Sometimes a coincidence is just a coincidence and Makhaira's focus on this detail feels out of place.

Hey Moody, do you have a night action? No need to specify faction or power. Simply, yes or no.

Noting it for now. Not inherently scummy imho but I'd like to see how it develops.

[Wam]

I'll do a proper post tomorrow, unless I don't. D1 is so performative and I'm pretty convinced that any ability to read this is well beyond me.

@Bessie have I ever made a good read, myself? an actual read, not like, mechanics analysis. I don't recall it ever happening, but you somehow have a photographic memory of 10+ years of mafia stuff (I'm another who started on xkcdia in 2012, hi)

I know I'm not bessie! But we always go through this madge your much better at this game than you ever give yourself credit for!

[Wam]

Wam – Completely conforming. I suspect Wam does not want to draw my attention. Suspicious.

Having been caught by you on a.confirmation post many many years ago they are always boring to make sure they are NAI.

You have the super notes when did I last not do "Confirm"? (As I can't remember)

[Wam]

Generally think Mak is aggressively barking up the wrong tree with the TMI theory but TBH I think that's more.lilely town Mak.

[moody7277]

Hey Moody, do you have a night action? No need to specify faction or power. Simply, yes or no.

Given this is a zesty game, I think vanilla is an endangered species. OTOH, Cynical View thoroughly approves bessie's reaction to your question.

[Bop]

Gonna start with direct addresses and new stuff mostly in this post and try to do some re-reading and general takes on players later.

Yeah my current read on this situation is I don't think Teh Bubblez's defensiveness at early day 1 votes is inherently scummy, but I also don't think Mak's doubling down is either. It feels like town butting heads but I'd love to hear more before really settling on that. Gotta vote somebody and all that and we have two pages of info (and not even every player yet).

And tbh, the longer I think of it, heuristically_alone's early finger of suspicion is almost more suspicious to me than any of the voting-casting aspersions with less attachment than a vote but more oomph than musing.

So for now I'm gonna

Vote: heuristically_alone

Why did you feel you “gotta vote somebody”?

Oh, this was more of a "speaking from the perspective of understanding Mak and Bubblez's initial votes." Voting is the only guaranteed action we've got and can get reactions that help with deductions. So, I like do understand the concept of random voting early on bc it can yield results, I just also don't think they should be dismissed as only fishing bc they're "more random" bc people lovvvvvvvvvvvvve to be cheeky. (I'm still scarred from a game where my mafia leader winked that they were the mob boss and got day killed in the first half a page. Every post counts.)

And tbh, the longer I think of it, heuristically_alone's early finger of suspicion is almost more suspicious to me than any of the voting-casting aspersions with less attachment than a vote but more oomph than musing.

So for now I'm gonna

Vote: heuristically_alone

The audacity and injustice of such a vote! Have you not considered that they already had a vote so why would I place a second vote on a player during the RVS phase?

I hadn't-but I don't know that a second vote is a level of heat that's dangerous in a 15 person game-be it an apparent faux pas of RVS or not.

I'll accept that as a light early meta read for now but you've tied your fates together in my reads until further notice so for your sake I hope you're right.

Very strong conclusion to draw from an 'accepted light early meta read'. Could have been in jest but doesn't feel that way, more like a justification for a later read.

No, I meant it! See "people love to be cheeky, every post counts" above. My paranoia that I'm missing something in these games in unmatched. It was light in tone, but I want it on the record if it helps me make sense of things later.

Oh boy, Adum gave us a confirmation phase! He must be super impressed by my renowned confirmation post analysis.

Oh, this rules. Can't wait to see how accurate this is on a re-read.

Generally think Mak is aggressively barking up the wrong tree with the TMI theory but TBH I think that's more.lilely town Mak.

I think I'm currently there as well? Like that specific line of questioning threw me but it felt earnest. I'll probably return to it when I've got more to go off of than gut there.

Hey Moody, do you have a night action? No need to specify faction or power. Simply, yes or no.

God I'm never a fan of the "magician setting up the trick" genre of post. Always uneasy bc it's inherently based on information we don't have.

[Wam]

It's a bit off but fyi I'm going to be low activity 22nd - 26th of Jan.

[ahippo]

Yeah, that's kinda the response I expected for that question. Very understandable. Still, hasn't much changed my opinions on anyone. Which at this point are almost universally "Gee, honestly, no clue." Y'all seem to know each other's styles much better than I.

unvote

I feel like the hand has been thoroughly shook. No genuine suspicion.

[EGW]

Hey I'm going out of town today, will catch up tomorrow when I return home.

[LaserGuy]

Yeah, that's kinda the response I expected for that question. Very understandable. Still, hasn't much changed my opinions on anyone. Which at this point are almost universally "Gee, honestly, no clue." Y'all seem to know each other's styles much better than I.

What were you expecting to learn from this? And what prompted you to ask moody in particular?

[LaserGuy]

lol, I took the vote as like a handshake or a high five! It would be rude to not reciprocate! Random voting is how old mafia forum cohorts show affection, right?

Also ahippos return vote is more returning a handshake than anything substantial.

This interaction is super weird but FWIW I had the same impression of ahippo's vote on moody so it could be coincidence/groupthink. I kinda agree with Sabrar that this is too on the nose to be staged.

[ahippo]

Honestly, I'm doing a lot of catchup on what the vibes are like. I really don't like being cagey and dodging direct questions. Is it suspicious to claim a role D1? Is it considered, like, rude? Or bad play? I mean if it is bad play, I could just own up to being a bad player.

[LaserGuy]

Honestly, I'm doing a lot of catchup on what the vibes are like. I really don't like being cagey and dodging direct questions. Is it suspicious to claim a role D1? Is it considered, like, rude? Or bad play? I mean if it is bad play, I could just own up to being a bad player.

Generally revealing role info early in the game is considered anti-Town because it helps scum optimize their night play, with minimal benefit to Town.

Claiming your own role early in the game isn't necessarily alignment indicative (personally, I tend to consider unprompted claims to be much more likely Town than not), though some would argue it is poor play. Trying to fish for another player's role is often considered very scum-indicative, though this is also context dependent.

Still doesn't answer my question though. Given that you didn't know this information, what were you hoping to learn from asking this of moody?

[Bop]

Honestly, I'm doing a lot of catchup on what the vibes are like. I really don't like being cagey and dodging direct questions. Is it suspicious to claim a role D1? Is it considered, like, rude? Or bad play? I mean if it is bad play, I could just own up to being a bad player.

I can't speak for the meta game of the forum but to try to get somebody else to claim a role in D1? That could make them a target depending on what it is I would say it's at best risky.

Say you out someone the mafia would very much like dead. Say you're hunting for a specific kind of role for some scummy or even non town independent purpose. It's early days so there's no inherent trust that your heart is in the right place(and that still wouldn't make it not risky.)

I think it's more the "you asked a direct question without any given reasoning as to why" that's at least my issue. Question doesn't feel direct when you're hiding your reasoning. Which you still did in this post.

Ninja'd!

Claiming your own role early in the game isn't necessarily alignment indicative (personally, I tend to consider unprompted claims to be much more likely Town than not), though some would argue it is poor play.
Still doesn't answer my question though. Given that you didn't know this information, what were you hoping to learn from asking this of moody?

Right, I wouldn't consider people claiming their own role early as scummy. But even if you're a townie fishing for information, you're at best letting everyone else on the side gain something too.

[ahippo]

I will point you to the fact that I explicitly did NOT ask for role. I simply asked "Do you have a power?"

Why Moody? Honest answer, when he voted for me, I just found it very endearing and wanted to ask someone I thought would answer. Vibes are all I've got right now.

Why do I care if Moody has a power? I can double a person's use of that power, once per night, only twice in the game, and on separate nights. Realizing now that if I do pick Moody, then that's an extra target on him, so ... yeah, it's useless if my target dies.

I'd probably just be better off using a random number generator to pick my target. I trust blind statistics more than my own intuition at this point.

[boomfrog]

I will point you to the fact that I explicitly did NOT ask for role. I simply asked "Do you have a power?"

Why Moody? Honest answer, when he voted for me, I just found it very endearing and wanted to ask someone I thought would answer. Vibes are all I've got right now.

Why do I care if Moody has a power? I can double a person's use of that power, once per night, only twice in the game, and on separate nights. Realizing now that if I do pick Moody, then that's an extra target on him, so ... yeah, it's useless if my target dies.

I'd probably just be better off using a random number generator to pick my target. I trust blind statistics more than my own intuition at this point.

Yep you should not have claimed that, but this is how we learn, don't sweat it, it's not the end of the world. Ideally you'd have said, "it's something related to my power" and dropped the conversation. But what's done is done. I recommend targeting someone you think is townie, but not necessarily the towniest person on your list just so scum don't know exactly who you are targeting. (and don't target me )

And you should not confirm your targeting plan or discuss it more, that only helps scum. Don't even say if you are going to follow my advice.

[boomfrog]

Checking in later than I expected, but I have to say it was a pretty good read. The whole handshake thing was fishy, but the replies after are what stand out to me.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Can you go into more detail please? Ideally with people's names so I know who you are talking about.

[boomfrog]

Going back to boomfrog's vote, It feels really weird for boomfrog to be so vocal so early about a serious read. >:/

Why is that?

Oh boy, Adum gave us a confirmation phase! He must be super impressed by my renowned confirmation post analysis.

Oh, this rules. Can't wait to see how accurate this is on a re-read.

Dang it. This is sincere. Bop is town. (or maaaybe he's scum who's already confident that there's another scum team, but probably town.)

Unvote

[boomfrog]

Town:
1. Mak
5. Sabrar
9. Bop
6. ahippo
7. TehBubblez

Neutral to scum lean:
3. Moody
4. Wam
14. Madge
10. Bessie
13. heuristically_alone
15. Laserguy

Assuming RL reasons for now and I'll get plenty of content later:
2. EGW

Not helping town:
11. Freddino
12. JC

Freddino and JC please post more so we can get a read on you or you will get the default vote by the end of the day.

Vote LaserGuy

[Sabrar]

@Boomfrog: could you please elaborate your read on LaserGuy? And also bessie if you are willing.

[ahippo]

Yep you should not have claimed that

You're probably right, but I do like having no more beans to spill. Assuming you trust what I said, I'm a known quantity. I'll accept that over trying to be cagey.

[JC_DADDY25]

Checking in later than I expected, but I have to say it was a pretty good read. The whole handshake thing was fishy, but the replies after are what stand out to me.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Can you go into more detail please? Ideally with people's names so I know who you are talking about.

I thought it was pretty obvious I was talking about Bop and ahippo in regards to the handshake, as far as the replies after I'm talking about everyone else's reaction to not only the situation, but the conversation and explanation in regards to the two of them using the same wording.

[JC_DADDY25]

@Boom Do you think Fred will post anything that will help town on day 1, and if you do... what makes you think so?