HaiLOWEEN 2023: AI apocalypse

[Seven]

+n -s

apologies for the quad

[Seven]

Hello there.

Hello, how are you

I have to disappear now

[heuristically_alone]

Care to expand on why you feel Laserguy might be setting up a mislynch on Bessie?

");

I disagree and am surprised by laserguy's assessment. Can't wait to hear future thoughts.

[heuristically_alone]

Hello there.

Acknowledging father figure

[JC_DADDY25]

This game is like a who's who of xkcd power players (and me), really excited to be playing with you all again.

@Adum, @JC, @Gluelock, have we played before? I don't think I recognize you.

I don't believe so, but not sure.

[AdumbroDeus]

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@Seven: was my pre-realising were Zen read correct?

I wasn't attempting to bait you or looking for a reaction. They were my genuine thoughts. However, I do not believe you are unable to tell the difference between anti-town and scum, and that was not a factor in my analysis.

Thank you, next question, what do you think Laserguy meant when they wondered how I interpreted you correctly without knowing who you were? And what do you think is the significance of Laserguy's assertion, even if we now know it's incorrect.

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I believe I only changed my name after you went on hiatus, so we haven't played or modded any games where I was Xivii so you should be good!

Ran, my discord name is Seven/Xivii/Zen. When Adum joined the server he recognized the Xivii and I presume overlooked the Zen.

Adum, how did you know I was Ro?

Appreciate the info, I'm not going into the game any further beyond what's necessary to explain my thought process. And we can talk about it after if you want.

I wasn't going to even say you're Ro because it didn't feel right outing the game publicly when you were actively trying to hide who you were.

And again I apologize for calling you salty, that was rude and unnecessary, I did it really hastily because I was busy (and honestly still am but got a second to post some stuff).

Also, since this notifies, I posted a question to you above, bolding your name.

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There is a game relevant reasons as to why I wish to know how you knew I was Ro. Do you not wish to share because it is a negative thing? And no worries regarding saltiness. I am a salt mine and I love you. Although this may potentially be due to synthetic pharmacological substance impacting my system.

Note: I believe that is the third time I used the word 'mine' this game. A careful observer might find that worthy of storing in their personal memory banks. But it isn't.

Somebody confirmed it in a non-public conversation. I don't want to say who because of the interaction of game and etiquette.

No, I don't think it's a negative but while it wasn't explicitly under confidence, I don't feel comfortable without asking the person in question if they're ok with it and I don't think I can either because they're in this game or it potentially spoils them as a replacement.

A compelling enough game reason might compell me to ask madge about it though.

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[AdumbroDeus]

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Hello there.

kenobi-thumb.png (169.87 KiB) Viewed 261381 times

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[AdumbroDeus]

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Care to expand on why you feel Laserguy might be setting up a mislynch on Bessie?

");

I disagree and am surprised by laserguy's assessment. Can't wait to hear future thoughts.

Yes that's obvious, I'm asking \"what issues you take with what specific things laserguy has said about Bessie?\"

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[Seven]

That's good enough, thank you! I asked because I revealed it publicly a few years ago. However, I was using "Xivii" by that time, so I wanted to see if you found out that way. If so, it would have contradicted you only now realizing that Xivii = Zen.

Regarding Laser, I think it's reasonable for him to have thought I was looking for a reaction out of you.

[LaserGuy]

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Either you're trying to bait out an OMGUS or you think I can't tell the difference between anti-town and scummy play. I'm honestly kind of insulted if it's the latter, after all I played in Megaman X Mafia, I know how anti-town town players can be.

Former could be done by either town or scum, in the former you're seeing if I scumslip, if the latter you're trying to needle me into getting mad or a scumslip.

Which was your intent, do you think so little of me or were you seeing a chance to test if I scumslipped? I obviously don't expect to admit it was s scum Gambit, but your admission of intent will be useful in understanding your thought process.

Both these posts are NAI, if you're abandoning posting 95% fluff, that's a good thing though.

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Wait. If you didn't know who Seven was, how on Earth were you able to interpret this correctly?

Circling back to this because I'm noting that you specifically said I interpreted Seven correctly, which I find interesting and notable? How do you know I was correct?


@Seven: was my pre-realising were Zen read correct?

It's interesting how you are changing the perspective on my quotes. I never said that your read was correct. I simply said that you were able to interpret correctly. Seven's claim was: Adum is mafia because I know Adum and X, Y, and Z are true things that I know about him. Now, if you did not know Seven at all, your reaction would most likely not be "No, X, Y, and Z are not true things about me", but rather "I don't know Seven at all, there is no way for him to know X, Y, or Z about me". You literally cannot interpret and respond to his claim properly without that context, because his claim would be nonsense to you.

[heuristically_alone]

It seems the main reason is Laserguy is suspicious of lack of reads list at this point, which I think is a weak read for Bessie at this point.

[Seven]

It seems the main reason is Laserguy is suspicious of lack of reads list at this point, which I think is a weak read for Bessie at this point.

My interpretation is that is George’s issue, not Laser’s.

[LaserGuy]

LaserGuy is one of the best players on this forum and I have no solid read but some light pings. Will elaborate after I think about it more.

I'm kind of flattered that you think this, though I don't agree with it at all.

Just skimming back through Sorc mafia, bessie posted her first Woof-Grr list on Tuesday; the game started the previous Thursday. She did post a bunch of scattered reads prior (not related to confirmation posts, she hasn't actually really been doing that in awhile), but not a full list.

I have noticed that players usually just post “Confirm” now so there is nothing to analyze. And I noted this is suspicious because I am sure it is deliberate, and mafia is afraid of my powers of deduction. I want to say you yourself have done this as scum, but I don’t have time to search for the game. It may have been on Smashboards. I may be misremembering, and it was someone else.

I seem to recall there was some game where I did a suspicious confirmation post on purpose to poke you, but I don't remember which game it was either. Maybe the one where I was using all emojis? I don't think you were in that game though. I do think that people have generally stopped doing interesting confirmation posts because of your propensity to analyze them in detail yes.

[LaserGuy]

Given how people how been routinely describing your abilities and the insight your posts show I initially found it hard to believe you missed that it was flavor not wincons. That you confirmed that you missed the "/s" suggesting Mak was kidding.

I said it was flavour? I'm not sure I really understand what you're trying to argue here.

I could read this as just being lazy with a less sophisticated player, but I don't think you'd make these mistakes. This reads more as casually normalizing misinfo that can be useful later (presumably for a lynch on Mak). Reminds me of Marshy in basic mafia actually.

How do you know what sort of mistakes I may or may not make? And how do you know what those types of mistakes might say about my alignment?

[LaserGuy]

Vote: moody7277

Welcome! Thanks for subbing in.

[LaserGuy]

I am moderately worried about Laserguy. Concerned with some reads, such as Bessie, might be seeing up a mislynch as Bessie's playstyle is notoriously townie. Will be interested to see more of Laser's evidence.

This feels super TMI to me, honestly. bessie's playstyle being townie does not mean that she is Town. How do you know she's a misyeet?

FWIW, I have played with bessie more than, I think, any other player in mafia, except possibly Sabrar or somitomi. I have good meta on her and can read her well enough that it was kind of a meme at one point in time that I always knew her alignment.

Moving heury to scum lean.

[Seven]

The two of you are talking past each other.

Adum's argument:
-Laser misinterpreted Mak's post as serious.
-Bessie and others have indicated that Laser is a top tier player
-A top-tier player wouldn't interpret Mak's post a serious. (e.g. wouldn't make the mistake)
-Therefore Laser is probably being ingenuine in his observations

What Laser was actually saying about Mak:
-Mak made a joke about the town flavor being survivalist
-A player is predisposed trying to understand their wincondition
-Therefore, as town, that bit about the flavor stood out to Mak

The part where Laser mentions Mak mistook the flavor is irrelevant to Laser's understanding that it was a joke. Boomfrog and others also took Mak as misunderstanding the Flavor.

Is that a fair assessment?

[LaserGuy]

That's good enough, thank you! I asked because I revealed it publicly a few years ago. However, I was using "Xivii" by that time, so I wanted to see if you found out that way. If so, it would have contradicted you only now realizing that Xivii = Zen.

I can't remember exactly how it came out, but I definitely know the name and some details of this story, so it's been around for awhile. It may have been in osie's game where you/fonti/bessie/Sabrar were scum and you had a big fight with Ran in D1? I knew what you were asking about when you brought up the name to Theallieza in WWZ so it's stuck in my memory somehow.

[Seven]

I am moderately worried about Laserguy. Concerned with some reads, such as Bessie, might be seeing up a mislynch as Bessie's playstyle is notoriously townie. Will be interested to see more of Laser's evidence.

This feels super TMI to me, honestly. bessie's playstyle being townie does not mean that she is Town. How do you know she's a misyeet?

FWIW, I have played with bessie more than, I think, any other player in mafia, except possibly Sabrar or somitomi. I have good meta on her and can read her well enough that it was kind of a meme at one point in time that I always knew her alignment.

Moving heury to scum lean.

I don't think it's TMI. This looks like heury thinking observing closely and thinking ahead. If it is scum heury than it is with scum bessie and he is trying to circumvent a push there by you.

[Seven]

Forgive typos btw, my proofread function is offline.

[LaserGuy]

The two of you are talking past each other.

Adum's argument:
-Laser misinterpreted Mak's post as serious.
-Bessie and others have indicated that Laser is a top tier player
-A top-tier player wouldn't interpret Mak's post a serious. (e.g. wouldn't make the mistake)
-Therefore Laser is probably being ingenuine in his observations

What Laser was actually saying about Mak:
-Mak made a joke about the town flavor being survivalist
-A player is predisposed trying to understand their wincondition
-Therefore, as town, that bit about the flavor stood out to Mak

The part where Laser mentions Mak mistook the flavor is irrelevant to Laser's understanding that it was a joke. Boomfrog and others also took Mak as misunderstanding the Flavor.

Is that a fair assessment?

Yes, that's what I'm saying.

[AdumbroDeus]

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Wait. If you didn't know who Seven was, how on Earth were you able to interpret this correctly?

Circling back to this because I'm noting that you specifically said I interpreted Seven correctly, which I find interesting and notable? How do you know I was correct?


@Seven: was my pre-realising were Zen read correct?

It's interesting how you are changing the perspective on my quotes. I never said that your read was correct. I simply said that you were able to interpret correctly. Seven's claim was: Adum is mafia because I know Adum and X, Y, and Z are true things that I know about him. Now, if you did not know Seven at all, your reaction would most likely not be "No, X, Y, and Z are not true things about me", but rather "I don't know Seven at all, there is no way for him to know X, Y, or Z about me". You literally cannot interpret and respond to his claim properly without that context, because his claim would be nonsense to you.

That's definitely not a concept I'd use "interpret correctly" to express. It's "why did I act in a manner that suggests I knew them when I didn't"?

Regardless, that's just a wrong assumption. Even if I didn't think I knew they were in my mafia community, the natural assumption was they read my games or talked about past games with people I played with. The vast majority of my games are public after all.

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[Seven]

I am moderately worried about Laserguy. Concerned with some reads, such as Bessie, might be seeing up a mislynch as Bessie's playstyle is notoriously townie. Will be interested to see more of Laser's evidence.

This feels super TMI to me, honestly. bessie's playstyle being townie does not mean that she is Town. How do you know she's a misyeet?

FWIW, I have played with bessie more than, I think, any other player in mafia, except possibly Sabrar or somitomi. I have good meta on her and can read her well enough that it was kind of a meme at one point in time that I always knew her alignment.

Moving heury to scum lean.

I don't think it's TMI. This looks like heury thinking observing closely and thinking ahead. If it is scum heury than it is with scum bessie and he is trying to circumvent a push there by you.

To clarify, I think the thinking ahead comes from either alignment (as scum, he's trying to prevent an elimination of a teammate). I actually do think he is probably a wolf. I just also think bessie is a wolf.

Heury speculating that somi is indy is one of the reasons why I think he's a wolf (finds somi suspicious but knows he's not mafia).

[LaserGuy]

It seems the main reason is Laserguy is suspicious of lack of reads list at this point, which I think is a weak read for Bessie at this point.

I've posted a number of reads throughout the game so far. I won't do a full readslist until much closer to EoD, but I've been posting my thoughts in thread about people as I go. I have made reads of you, moody, Makhaira, BoomFrog, Adum, bessie and EGW so far.

[Seven]

It seems the main reason is Laserguy is suspicious of lack of reads list at this point, which I think is a weak read for Bessie at this point.

I've posted a number of reads throughout the game so far. I won't do a full readslist until much closer to EoD, but I've been posting my thoughts in thread about people as I go. I have made reads of you, moody, Makhaira, BoomFrog, Adum, bessie and EGW so far.

He's saying that your main reason for finding bessie suspicious is her not doing a read list. (But that was George's reasoning, not yours).